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Max Chernov visits Shanghai to interview Paul Ashton, an American who has lived in China for eight years and became known for the city not city meme. Their conversation covers cultural differences between the United States and China, how Chinese people react to foreigners, and how living in China changed Paul's view of the US. He shares experiences learning Chinese, receiving compliments on his language, and navigating everyday interactions, including a funny elevator moment in Beijing. They discuss Shanghai's global character and local warmth, social expectations, surveillance, safety, and urban development. Paul also explains how the meme spread across Chinese social media and changed his work, then talks about using views to earn income, brand payments, and the role of MCNs and platforms. Their discussion places personal experiences alongside broader perceptions of China and the US.
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Paul Ashton on life in Shanghai
Max Chernov meets Paul Ashton, an American who has lived in China for eight years and became known for the city not city meme. Paul explains why he chose Shanghai and describes how the city combines international exposure with local warmth. He talks about how Chinese people react to foreigners and how living in China has changed his view of the United States. Their conversation covers cultural differences, education, independence, and the balance between individuality and community.
They also discuss learning Chinese and the reactions Paul receives when speaking it. Compliments on language are common early on, while longer conversations can provide more genuine feedback. A child mislabels a foreigner, and the pair recall a humorous elevator moment in Beijing. These stories illustrate everyday cultural exchange and the curiosity people may show toward foreigners. The discussion is grounded in Paul's experience and does not claim that each person or place shares the same outlook.
The city not city meme and social media work
Paul explains how the city not city meme began and spread across Chinese social media. The conversation follows the change from his earlier work before social media to the success of his videos, which altered his work life. He discusses converting views into income, what brands pay per video, and how creators work with MCNs and platforms to reach audiences while maintaining an authentic voice. The pair also consider how the meme is understood by international viewers and how it shaped perceptions of China.
Government, urban change, and daily life
Max and Paul talk about surveillance perceptions, cameras in daily life, personal safety, infrastructure, and the pace of development in Shanghai compared with other Chinese cities. They consider generational differences, American cultural narratives, and the changing relationship between China and the United States. Paul emphasizes empathy and cultural relativism, drawing on years of living in China to explain why outsiders should look beyond simple national narratives.
The conversation stays personal, using Paul's experiences to discuss broader topics. It moves from language and interactions on the street to work, business, social media, and public perceptions. Max guides the discussion with questions about Shanghai's social fabric and the ways living abroad can affect a person's view of home. The episode offers Paul's perspective as an American expat in China and the views he has developed over eight years, rather than a single definitive account of either country.
FAQs (From the traveler's perspective)
- Q: How long has Paul Ashton lived in China?
- A: Paul has lived in China for eight years. In the interview, he talks about life in Shanghai and how the experience changed his view of the United States.
- Q: What is the city not city meme?
- A: It is the meme Paul became known for, which spread across Chinese social media. He describes how its success changed his work and led to questions about turning views into income.
- Q: What topics do Max and Paul discuss?
- A: They talk about cultural differences, learning Chinese, social media work, business, surveillance perceptions, urban development, and daily life in Shanghai.
